CR 059: Jon Agee on Tackling Big Themes for Little Readers
The award-winning writer-illustrator discusses his career and his latest picture book, “George & Lenny Are Always Together.”
Since 1981, Jon Agee has written and illustrated dozens of picture books, using deadpan humor and cartoonish imagery to break down complex issues for young readers. (Though adults can benefit from his work, as well. His 2018 release, The Wall in the Middle of the Book, should be required reading for members of Congress.)
His latest book is George & Lenny Are Always Together, which tells the story of a bear and a rabbit who have a deep bond, but are faced with a challenge when Lenny decides he wants to spend some time alone. It is a sweet, clever story that teaches children about friendship, independence, and healthy boundaries. And though the book was only released a few months ago, Agee is already nearly done with the next book in the series.
“I’m almost finished with the sequel to George & Lenny,” Agee says. “It’s funnier than the first one. It’s called George & Lenny Are Looking at Clouds. It echoes the first book, in that George has a very big imagination and Lenny is much more grounded, but there’s a little bit of a push-pull between nonsense and logic. Both of them get to exist in this funny space.”
I recently spoke with Agee over Zoom about his creative process, his influences, and the most rewarding aspects of his career.
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SANDRA EBEJER: I read that you studied art and filmmaking in college. How did that transition into a career in writing and illustrating children’s books?
JON AGEE: I’d always been writing books. I took painting and filmmaking at college, but when it came time for my final exhibit, I ended up not showing films or paintings. I showed these very small drawings. Some of them were cartoons. Some of them were sequential. There were stories. And when I look back on that—because one of them ended up being my second picture book—there was something telling in that experience. I’d gone to school to study art, and there was no course for writing and illustrating picture books, but I was doing it all along.
if I counted correctly, George & Lenny Are Always Together is your 36th book.
Could be!
How is it for you when a new book is published? Do you still feel excitement around a new release, or have you already moved on to the next thing?
The latter. It never stops being exciting when a book’s about to be available in stores. But it is an interesting career where, when the new book is out, it’s been nine months, sometimes a year, since you’ve actually really looked at it and you’re on to other things.
Where did the idea for the George & Lenny book come from?
Like so many of my stories, they come from drawing pictures of people, characters, animals talking to each other and seeing where that will lead. This was simply a conversation between these two creatures and the dialogue between them, [with] the bear being very happy that they were always together and the rabbit curious about what it would be like to be alone. I sent my publisher six or seven different ideas for my next book and she zeroed in on this one and said, “I think there’s so much charm in these two characters that you should follow through with this and keep going.” So that’s how it came about.
I’ve interviewed many picture book authors who have said that it’s difficult to come up with a story that will have an impact, and write and illustrate it in a way that will make sense to little ones. Do you ever have difficulties in making an idea gel with the way it has to be drawn or written for little kids?
Yeah, it’s true. It’s one of the hurdles. The challenge that’s so unique to writing and illustrating books for children is conveying complex ideas in very simple ways. I love that challenge, because even with grown-ups, I love it when people can describe things in ways that a younger person can understand. Certainly with picture books, the pictures can really help subtract the need for a written explanation. That’s key to the picture book when it’s done well.
Do you ever have moments where it’s just not working? Where you know you want to tell a specific story, but you can’t quite find a way in?
Oh, yeah, sure. There seems to be certain places you cannot go in a picture book. I remember trying to write a story about a kid whose father was in jail. Now, I’m sure for a nonfiction story you could do it, but to write a picture book that was funny and offbeat was very tricky. And there are certain lines that are more challenging than it is worth to go there, at least for me. But most of my challenge, most of the dead ends I experience, are simply finding a satisfying resolution to a story. I have boxes filled with really great ideas for beginnings of stories or even middles of stories, but tying everything together is the biggest issue for me.
What comes first for you, the story or the picture? Or does it vary from book to book?
I think pictures. As I was saying, I start with people and characters talking to each other, people who’ve met each other on the street.
Do you draw or write every day?
Almost, yeah. Certainly one or the other. I keep a journal, so I’m always writing and drawing.
Who are your influences? Or if you’re looking for inspiration, who or what are some of the things you turn to?
Well, my earliest influence was probably Edward Lear, the British writer-Illustrator, who wrote those famous limericks. I loved his illustrations and goofy stories. And then more recently, I’ve really admired the work of Jon Klassen, the guy who does the books about the bear and the hat, This is Not My Hat. I like his simplicity of storytelling, but also the complex nature of the plots. I’m looking up on my shelf now. I love so many different illustrators. Christian Robinson—I love his pictures. He’s a contemporary. And Roald Dahl and Tomi Ungerer. The list goes on. I’m in awe of so many great writer-illustrators. It’s a long list.
You’ve been in this line of work for decades, and unlike when you started, kids now have screens to pull their attention away. Have you found that there’s still an audience for your work, as much as there was when you first started?
Oh, interesting. It’s hard for me to answer, because when I go to schools, kids seem excited and engaged. But I do hear from teachers that there’s competition for their attention with screens. Not only their individual smartphones, but Chromebooks. There’s some part of me which is just dreading where this is all going, so I don’t entirely pay attention to it.
Has technology changed the way you approach your work, either the content or the way you write your books?
Not so much the content. I still paint them and use physical materials—watercolor, pencil, ink. But then I scan them, and I use the computer to digitally manipulate them. And then I send my entire book to my publisher via one of those [digital] services and they print it from that. That’s new, so I have adjusted in that way.
Is there anything you haven’t done in your career that you’d still like to attempt?
Well, there was a period of time, years ago, when I collaborated with a composer and we wrote two musicals for kids in New York City. And they still, from time to time, bring them back. The theater company is still alive, and they still bring back the musicals we wrote. That I loved doing, and I think I was pretty darn good at it, writing lyrics and so forth, but it wasn’t really sustainable as a profession. I would love to do that again if it was sustainable.
What advice do you have for those who aspire to write or illustrate children’s books?
I never went into it to make money. I was told back in 1981, “Don’t plan on making a living doing this. It’s not very profitable. It’s very tough to make a go of it.” And then things changed in the mid ’80s, and children’s books became very profitable and everybody wanted to join in. [Laughs] But now it’s a different playing field. It’s very competitive. And I think it would be a different experience to jump into picture books now than it was when I started, where I could just walk into a publisher and meet with an editor. It was a very different time.
I would say, have the passion. If you really love telling stories and illustrating those stories, then you’ve got to try it. Gotta get your foot in the door. Getting your foot in the door is [key]. In picture books, getting that first book published can open up a lot of avenues.
You mentioned earlier in our conversation that you still go to a lot of schools and talk to kids. Are there any questions that they tend to ask over and over again?
The questions they ask are often not unlike some of the ones you asked. “Do you start with pictures or words? How many books have you written?” That’s a classic one. I remember one time they asked me, “Why do your characters always have mustaches?” I was like, “Do they? Do they have mustaches?” At the time I was writing and illustrating books [where] the protagonists were these middle-aged men. This was maybe 10 years ago. There had been a whole slew of books about middle-aged men, and they did have mustaches. And so I had to prove to the kids that I could draw a mouth.
Wow. Tough critics! What do you want readers, both young and old, to get from George & Lenny Are Always Together?
When I write a book, I don’t generally know what the book is about. I just write it, and then it gets to the end and there’s this lovely ending, and I think, “My work is done here. Now I can refine it.” I think if there is a message [with] George & Lenny, it’s about the fact that we can have very different sensibilities as friends, and we can respect each other’s differences. George is very clingy. He does not want to be alone, but he respects Lenny’s desire to be alone. And George himself ends up being alone, but in his own unique way. Somebody might say, “That’s not being alone,” but to George, that’s being alone. So there’s something about friendships and differences and respecting each other’s boundaries.
What’s been the most rewarding aspect of your career so far?
I never cease to be grateful and happy that I can create something here at my table from up here in my head, and I have this loyal, enthusiastic publisher who can help me guide that idea into a good book and then bring it out into the world. It never fails to make me pleased. I think maybe the first book that I published when I was 22 years old was a thrill. But meeting all the people in my world, the other writers and illustrators who I’ve met over the years, that’s been a wonderful thing, too. I do really appreciate all the other people who do what I do.
To learn more about Jon Agee, visit his website.
To purchase George & Lenny Are Always Together, click here.
This interview has been edited for clarity and length.
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